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Apistogramma id, pls...

Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
It looks more like an A. agassizii female to me.

As for A. meinkeni, the first thing is that many pertensis-complex species have been sold as 'A. meinkeni'. The true A. meinkeni can be sexed like many non-dimorphic apistos by the shape of the dorsal fin tip and fullness of the body, but these are generally only visible in fully mature adults. One other sex difference is that females show a pale yellowish abdomen while on males this area is a dirty white.
 

Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
Yes, it appears to be A. meinkeni. The 2 spots, lateral spot (Bar 3) and flank spot (Bar 2) are diagnostic for this species. Not only that, but it appears that you have both sexes.
 

Frank_H

Active Member
5 Year Member
Mike are you sure it's A. meinkeni? Based on the above photos, imo they could also be A. sp. Tiquie.
 

Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
Pretty sure it's A. meinkeni. Tiquié has a more subterminal mouth on a more rounded head profile. The flank spot on Bar 2 on Tiquié tends to be merged with the postorbital stripe and not separate in most moods, like on A. meinkeni. Male Tiquié also have a more squared-off terminal edge to the caudal fin.
 

Frank_H

Active Member
5 Year Member
Thanks for your explanation Mike. However, given the variablity/mood-dependency of these subtle differences, I will probably need to see some more and better photos to become confident about the ID of these fish.
 

Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
I agree. Then we could always 'euthanize' some specimens and to some meristic counts, including counting the number of infraorbital pores.;)
 

jeonghun

Member
5 Year Member
More picture
 

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Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
Me? Most likely they are A. meinkeni. I gave my reasons why they are this species previously. Why do you think they are A. sp. Tiquié? I'm always open to being wrong. Lord knows, my beautiful wife lets me know on a regular basis!:D
 

Frank_H

Active Member
5 Year Member
These are the reasons why I believe they are A. sp. Tiquie rather than A. meinkeni:

1. The first two membranes of the dorsal are blackened as is common in both sexes of Tiquie, whereas in meinkeni only brooding females are supposed to show this coloration. Additionally the first 5 (or so) membranes of the dorsal seem to be more “spiky”/serrated than in meinkeni.

2. The upper edge of the dorsal can show a red/orange seam, like in both sexes of Tiquie. Instead meinkeni show a much narrower white seam (as also known from other pertensis-complex species/forms).

3. As in Tiquie, the often horizontally extended rectangular/trapezoid caudal spot is narrower than the lateral band. In meinkeni it is roundish/oval and wider than the lateral band.

4. In some moods (e.g. aggression) the lateral spot extends clearly above the lateral band (and sometimes also a bit below), which is also the case in Tiquie but not in meinkeni (perhaps with the exception of stressed specimens).

5. As in Tiquie the lateral band often noticeably widens in bar 7 due to the addition of dark pigmentation above (and sometimes also below) the lateral band.

6. As in Tiquie, the suborbital stripe is wider than in meinkeni, especially directly at the eye.
 
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