Ccihlid Atlas

[madpiano]

Hiya

It's good if you are bilingual in this hobby

I have just had a look at the german web-site of Amazon and found the Koslowski book there, but it didn't get a good critique.

If you speak german, here is the link
http://www.amazon.de/exec/obidos/tg/stores/detail/-/books/3800138204/glance/028-5298458-0966133#

as most of you don't here some points which were raised:

- the photo quality is very bad in the book as most photos are too dark

- there is only minimal information about husbandry of the fish and the book is only useful to specialists (whatever that is supposed to mean)

- the book decribes each species into minute detail and covers Apistogramma, Taeniacara, Mikrogeophagus

- the pictures have no numbers or descriptions, so it is difficult to co-relate the text to the pictures

- the author keeps talking bad about his collegue Romer which apparently gets quite annoying through the book

- The book is a very detailed study of Dwarf Cichlids, but due to the above points very difficult to read. It is not recommended to beginners.

As I haven't read the book I cannot comment on the above points. If anyone has read the book, can you confirm this ?

As I can buy books in german or english, which one would you recommend ?

I currently have

"South American Dwarf Cichlids" by Hans J. Mayland & Dieter Bork
Landbuch Verlag 1997

I am still trying to learn about dwarf cichlids and would love a book where I can see the fish and can make sure I get the one I want (don't allways trust my LFS to have the right names on the tanks :roll: )

Thanks
Sabine

 

[Randall]

Koslowski vs. Romer

Dear Sabine,

From my experience with the better dwarf cichlids reference books that are available to hobbyiests, each one, in its own way, is of some value...perhaps some more than others.

Romer's atlas is probably the most comprehensive reference of its kind, especially where Apistogramma is concerned. Yet, I've heard criticism regarding the photos depicted. Of interest to me personally is that there are numerous photos of each species discussed, so taken collectively, the reader can get a pretty good idea of what any particular species looks like.

My concern with Romer's atlas doesn't relate to the photography used but, rather, to some of the text. Dr. Romer, in some instances, furnishes information regarding the husbandry and breeding of particular species as a matter of fact, when it would be of more benefit to the reader if he qualified the information furnished as that of his own personal experience. I've heard criticism from others along these lines as well. The misIDs and inaccuracies aside, I think it it an excellent reference.

Yes, Koslowski's book tends to be more specialized and, perhaps, is of most value to advanced level hobbyiests and to those who study phylogeny. To the author's credit, however, I think Dr. Koslowski surely new this when he wrote the book!

I wish to point out that the Koslowski source (in German only) is the only reference of its kind available to hobbyists that clearly deliniates the major species groups and the numerous species complexes within those groups. With currently ca. 200 known Apistogramma forms, not inclusive of color morphs corresponding to separate populations, Dr. Koslowski does a great job of making heads and tails out of the entire tribe. I don't perceive that it was the author's intention to publish a reference that delt with hobbyist oriented discussion of husbandry and breeding.

As to which book to get, I enjoy both for different reasons. The Romer source does tend to be more hobbyist friendly, while Koslowski's might appeal more to those who want to learn more about phylogeny.

Thank you.

Randall Kohn

 

[madpiano]

The misIDs and inaccuracies aside

Hmmm, I am really looking for a book which allows me to idendtify the species at the LFS tank (not too concerned about the males, more the females). Would Romer be good for that ?

On the other hand, as I am looking to buy Cactoides, could someone maybe just tell me how to make 100% sure, that I have the right species (male and female) ? That would save me from having to buy another book ?

Thanks
Sabine

 

[Randall]

Apisto Purchases

Dear Sabine,

Hmmm. If you're merely looking to verify A. cacatuoides' identity in a local retailer's tank, such is not a cause for concern. A. cacatuoides is one of the more common Apistogramma species and is instantly recognizable, even to rank novices. To ID such a fish, one need not buy a book. If I may suggest, simply take a dwarf cichlid book off the retailer's shelf and look up what you would like to know there in the shop.

If your interest in Apistogramma can be summed up by, "That would save me from having to buy another book.", perhaps you would be better served investing in Cichla species instead.

Yours,

Randall Kohn

 

[madpiano]

If I may suggest, simply take a dwarf cichlid book off the retailer's shelf

I wish I could, but the Retailers here don't allways carry Dwarf Cichlids Books. The place where I am going to buy the pair from hasn't got any books at all....

If your interest in Apistogramma can be summed up by, "That would save me from having to buy another book.", perhaps you would be better served investing in Cichla species instead.

I already got one book about Dwarf Cichlids and I have been looking all over the net as well, to make sure I get the right kind of Dwarf for my tank and water (so I did do my reading :wink: ), but I am refurbishing my tank and its costing me more than anticipated, so I don't really want to spend another £50 just yet on another book. That will have to wait. Those £50 are currently better spent in making the tank as nice as possible for my fish (and me), don't you think ?

Yes, cactoides look very distinctive....if you see them next to another Apisto. But if there is no others around, can I be sure I get the same ones ?

I may just panicking here for nothing... I haven't seen any in the shops for ages and I may find, that as soon as I see them I will be able to recognize them, but I just want to make sure I don't get any of the acid water species by accident. (My water has a PH of 7-7.2 and dGH of 8).

Is there anything I need to look out for, to make sure I get the right Apisto ? The fish I am going to buy will propably be the only ones in te tank and may be very frightened, so I understand, their colours and markings could be slightly different than the pictures on the net ?

Does anyone maybe know of a breeder near London, UK ? (that would make things easier).

Greetings
Sabine

 

[Neil]

madpiano,

WELCOME TO THE FORUM

Great name!
Suprisingly enough, there are many species that look quite similar to cacatuoides. However, most of these will do allright in your water, so that shouldn't stop you. Distinguishing features to look for are 3 light lines under the lateral line (the horizontal line running down the middle of the fish), big lips, extended rays on the dorsal fin in the male, a lyretail (male), and maybe blotches of color on the back end of the dorsal fin. Some of these characteristics will be apparent only in more adult fish. Sometimes it can be difficult to differentiate between genders in these fish also. Adult fish should be no problem and will have less developed rays on the dorsal and a more rounded caudal fin (tail). They will also usually have a distinctive black front edge to the ventral fin (under the chest).
I should mention here that, if you are unfamilar with ID characteristics, this may help:
http://www.apistogramma.com/descriptionchar-article.htm
The main thing to look for is those sub-lateral lines in cacatuoides. They are a dead give-away. Other fish have them, but most likely, if they are in an LFS, they are cacatuoides.
Neil

 

[aspen]

sabine, you don't need a book to ensure you get some nice cacatoides. here's a link with some places to buy apistos in the u.k. maybe 1 is close enough to visit?

http://www.apistogramma.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=656

if not, they will surely direct you.

hth, rick

 

[madpiano]

Hello

Thanks for your answers.

Neil: That was the kind of information I was looking for. I do think that most likley the Apistos I see at the LFS are going to be Cactoides and Agassizi, but you never know :roll:

Rick: I know of those sites. But A) they are quite expensive and B) I would like to see the fish before I buy. But thanks anyway. If I can't find them in the shops, I will go and order from Mr Fish. Are Apistos seasonal ? I don't really need to have a wild caught fish and would actually prefer a tank bred / Singapore bred fish anyway.

One more question (sorrry). Can Apistos and Ghost Shrimp be kept in the same tank (without the shrimp becoming food) ?

Thanks for all your help
Sabine

 

[farm41]

I keep shrimp in all my tanks, and they all have apisto's. You will be fine.

 

[madpiano]

Great, as my Shrimp tank will be modified to house Pygmy Puffers