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Nannostomus ID
- Thread starter raymond82
- Start date
- Messages
- 144
- Location
- Norway, Trondheim
Tom C do you know a good book or other source of information about the different Nannostomus ?
With regards
RHD
With regards
RHD
- Messages
- 144
- Location
- Norway, Trondheim
thank you for the answer raymond82, ill have a look at seriouslyfish.com
I am a regular visitor of apisto.sites.no
I am a regular visitor of apisto.sites.no
here is a paper with some good info to help with i.d.ing your pencilfish
http://www.sil.si.edu/SmithsonianContributions/Zoology/pdf_hi/SCTZ-0186.pdf
hope this is of use
regards
joe
http://www.sil.si.edu/SmithsonianContributions/Zoology/pdf_hi/SCTZ-0186.pdf
hope this is of use
regards
joe
- Messages
- 144
- Location
- Norway, Trondheim
Thank you joemc, just downloaded the paper. Just what i was looking for. Looking forward to start reading it.
With regards
RHD
With regards
RHD
Nannostomus espei is one of my favorites. They are quite difficult to breed, so you'll get a true challenge here...
The first important paper was "Review of South American Characid Fishes of Subtribe Nannostomina" by Stanley H. Weitzman in 1966
Then came "A Revision of the South American Fishes of the Genus Nannostomus Giinther (Family Lebiasinidae) by Stanley H. Weitzman and J. Stanley Cobb in 1975, which joemc linked to above.
Then "Three New Species of Fishes of the Genus Nannostomus from the Brazilian States of Para and Amazonas" by Stanley H. Weitzman in 1978. (Note that Figure 3 in this version of the paper is a wrong picture)
After that Nannostomus anduzei was described in 1987, Nannostomus mortentaleri in 2001, Nannostomus rubrocaudatus in 2009, and finally Nannostomus grandis was described in 2011.
Nannostomus espei is one of my favorites. They are quite difficult to breed, so you'll get a true challenge here...
In all honesty, I've never really attempted to breed any of the Nannostomus I have, I keep them with my apisto's because they make such good dither fish. But with the espei coming, maybe I should try because they are a very nice species indeed!
- Messages
- 144
- Location
- Norway, Trondheim
Thanks Tom C.
raymond82 good luck with breeding N. espei Very nice Nannostomus. I`v been looking for it here in Norway, but not found it yet.
With regards
RHD
raymond82 good luck with breeding N. espei Very nice Nannostomus. I`v been looking for it here in Norway, but not found it yet.
With regards
RHD
- Messages
- 703
- Location
- Clarkston, WA
Nannostomus can be a real challenge tp propagate but very rewarding when it works. Nannostomus beckfordi is the "beginner's" species to breed. They are pretty easy to breed. Their fry are tiny and slow growing at first but they finish off fast and can begin spawning as early as six months old. Most of those in shops are farm raised and that accounts for much of their relative ease. The wild specimens of the other species are a few notches higher on my "Difficulty" breeding scale.
I've never tried breeding any Nannostomus, I strictly use them as dithers. However, I have to agree it's worth trying. I have a trio (I had two more but they died) of N. espei and they're realy beautiful, it's almost a shame to not try to breed them. The problem is that I don't have space to put up a separate tank for them.
- Messages
- 11,222
- Location
- Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
No room? They'll breed in a 1 gallon pickel jar! Of course a 2½ or 5 gallon tank would be better.
Hahaha, a 1 gallon pickle jar we might actually have laying around somewhere. But seriously, I didn't know they don't need so much space, we have plenty of 12 liter aquariums so maybe when one is empty I can give it a try. I'll do some reading up on how to breed Nannostomus, I also have quite some N. marginatus which might be easier to begin with.
- Messages
- 703
- Location
- Clarkston, WA
Mike is right. Nannostomus breed in small tanks. I built some 4.5 gal tanks for breeding small Characins and Killifish. They are 16 X 8 X 8 inches. I cover the bottom with "egg crate" fluorescent light diffuser grids covered with nylon fly scree,. The screen is tacked to the grid with tiny amounts of SuperGlue. I also give them thick acrylic yarn spawning mops. Pencilfish eggs are non-adhesive and many fall through the bottom mesh. Pencifish are notorious egg eaters. They sometimes whirl around immediately after releasing fertilized eggs and eat them. To minimize the fall time of the eggs I only fill the tanks so there is no more than 4 inches/10 cm of water above the mesh.
Anyone who successfully breeds N. espei is a very skilled breeder. N. beckfordi and N. marginatus are the two easiest species of Nannostomus to breed. If I had a pair of N. espei I'd sure give it a try. I have also actual bred Nannostomus in 2-1/2 gal acrylic tanks in no more than 1 gal of water. So if one is so inclined, it really doesn't tank much space. I start of initially using only an air stone set to bubble slowly. I add a small aged sponge filter after the fry have grown a little and have increased the water depth to about 6 inches.
I gradually raise the water level an inch at a time about ever 10 days post free swimming. I am an old school in that before I attempt to breed these fishes I begin infusoria cultures in 1 to 2 liter jars about 10 days prior to my anticipate need for them. The fry often grow unevenly and some still need infusoria for 2 weeks but there can be considerable over lap between the infusoria/mikroworms/bbs stages among the young fry. I aloso mildy aerate infusoria cultures and place them in a well lighted location so some "green water" cultures simultaneously form with infusoria. Mild aeration also helps to prevent foul smelling and polluted infusoria cultures.
I usually use RO water adjusted to 10 ppm TDS for breeding. I acclimate my breeders to this same water prior to setting up breeding pairs or reverse trios. They are easier to breed in groups but groups can result in greater egg predation. I place the breeders in the breeding tank in the late afternoon. Most of the time they breed the next morning at sunrise. If they do not breed I leave them for 24 more hours. I do not feed them in the breeding tank unless I happen to have access to Daphnia. In that case I'll put a 100 or so in along with the breeders. It doesn't take much to try breeding them in terms of effort, materials and space. You never know until you try. Having even a few home bred specimens surivive is a source of self accomplishment. Especially if they are among the rare and/or more expensive species.
Anyone who successfully breeds N. espei is a very skilled breeder. N. beckfordi and N. marginatus are the two easiest species of Nannostomus to breed. If I had a pair of N. espei I'd sure give it a try. I have also actual bred Nannostomus in 2-1/2 gal acrylic tanks in no more than 1 gal of water. So if one is so inclined, it really doesn't tank much space. I start of initially using only an air stone set to bubble slowly. I add a small aged sponge filter after the fry have grown a little and have increased the water depth to about 6 inches.
I gradually raise the water level an inch at a time about ever 10 days post free swimming. I am an old school in that before I attempt to breed these fishes I begin infusoria cultures in 1 to 2 liter jars about 10 days prior to my anticipate need for them. The fry often grow unevenly and some still need infusoria for 2 weeks but there can be considerable over lap between the infusoria/mikroworms/bbs stages among the young fry. I aloso mildy aerate infusoria cultures and place them in a well lighted location so some "green water" cultures simultaneously form with infusoria. Mild aeration also helps to prevent foul smelling and polluted infusoria cultures.
I usually use RO water adjusted to 10 ppm TDS for breeding. I acclimate my breeders to this same water prior to setting up breeding pairs or reverse trios. They are easier to breed in groups but groups can result in greater egg predation. I place the breeders in the breeding tank in the late afternoon. Most of the time they breed the next morning at sunrise. If they do not breed I leave them for 24 more hours. I do not feed them in the breeding tank unless I happen to have access to Daphnia. In that case I'll put a 100 or so in along with the breeders. It doesn't take much to try breeding them in terms of effort, materials and space. You never know until you try. Having even a few home bred specimens surivive is a source of self accomplishment. Especially if they are among the rare and/or more expensive species.
Thank you very much! With such clear instructions I'd be foolish not to try to breed them! I don't even know how to sex them properly but two fish look a lot more roundish so I think I have two females and one male. I have plenty of 30x2x20 cm killi tanks around and I'm gonna have a look to see if I can free one for this experiment.
I don't have light diffuser grids but I do have some nylon mesh that I can use. So if I understand it correctly, if the fish are in good condition all I have to do is put them together?
I don't have light diffuser grids but I do have some nylon mesh that I can use. So if I understand it correctly, if the fish are in good condition all I have to do is put them together?
Hague1982
New Member
- Messages
- 24
- Location
- Leyland, Lancashire, UK
defo worth ago brilliant instructions when I wake up i'm of to get some nylon fly screen!
- Messages
- 703
- Location
- Clarkston, WA
It is almost mandatory in my opinion that the breeders are well conditioned by generously feeding them live foods. Variety is best but brine shrimp nauplii will do. I also segregate the sexes for a few days prior to placing them in the spawning tank.
Devising some way to prevent the fish from eating most of their eggs is a must. There are many ways but I've never found an easier way than making the screen bottom barrier.
N. espei are not easy to breed so don't get discouraged if at first you don't succeed. Keep trying until you do or try an easier species of Pencilfish for the practice. Breeding Characins can sometimes be really easy and other times hard. I have tried to breed and raise Paracheirodon spp. all my life yet I still haven't had an unqualified success. I have only had common Neons spawn nearly every time but usually all their eggs have gone bad within 24 hours or what few larvae I have obtained have died before ever going free swimming. I have bred many dozens of Characin species but all my attempts with Neons, Green Neons and Cardinal Tetras have failed. I have had great success with N. beckfordi, Black Neons, Glow Lights, Black Phantoms, Red Phantoms and Ember Tetras.
Devising some way to prevent the fish from eating most of their eggs is a must. There are many ways but I've never found an easier way than making the screen bottom barrier.
N. espei are not easy to breed so don't get discouraged if at first you don't succeed. Keep trying until you do or try an easier species of Pencilfish for the practice. Breeding Characins can sometimes be really easy and other times hard. I have tried to breed and raise Paracheirodon spp. all my life yet I still haven't had an unqualified success. I have only had common Neons spawn nearly every time but usually all their eggs have gone bad within 24 hours or what few larvae I have obtained have died before ever going free swimming. I have bred many dozens of Characin species but all my attempts with Neons, Green Neons and Cardinal Tetras have failed. I have had great success with N. beckfordi, Black Neons, Glow Lights, Black Phantoms, Red Phantoms and Ember Tetras.
I'm gonna try this week, I already have some ideas on how to prepare the aquarium. The two females I have look quite well fed and round, hopefully they're in good condition. The only thing I'm wondering, what is the minimum size the mazes in the mesh need to be for the eggs to fall through?
