PH went up after introducing aeration

[mgfiest]

Before I put in the aeration in my tank my PH was 7.6 now it's 8.3

Ammonia is 0
KH & Gh are 3 on the drop system
nitrate is under 20
nitrite is 0
using fluval peat in filter
tank is 90gal
9 fish different kinds of south american
no plants
54 watts of light for 6 hours.

was going to add 2 GBR but with this increase I not too sure.

 

[gerald]

What is your tap water pH (after sitting in an open container for a couple hours)? Since you dont have any plants to consume CO2, (and I'm guessing not much algae either, or you would have mentioned it) I dont see any reason why aeration would raise pH, unless you're getting CO2 build-up from decaying organic matter.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

Before I put in the aeration in my tank my PH was 7.6 now it's 8.3.

I think Gerald is right, but it is to do with the amount of CO2 and O2, and the low levels of oxygen/high levels of CO2 are just from the respiration of the fish (and the biological filtration of the ammonia that they produce).

Because you don't have any plants, and you have a reasonable fish load, before you added dissolved oxygen (from the air pump) you had oxygen levels that were below saturation level and dissolved CO2 levels that were higher than the equilibrium value with air.

At atmospheric CO2 levels (~400ppm), a very small proportion of dissolved CO2 is "carbonic acid" (H2CO3) and in equilibrium with HCO3- (from your dKH). This equilibrium is stable at pH8.2 with 100% oxygen saturation (oxygen is a base).

If you drive the CO2 ~ HCO3- equilibrium towards CO2 (you have dissolved CO2 levels that are above those at equilibrium level) the pH will fall. This <"link"> gives a good explanation.

In your case you had higher CO2 levels, but the increase in the gas exchange surface area (from the aeration) added oxygen and out-gassed CO2, so the pH rose.

cheers Darrel

 

[mgfiest]

city water pH is 7.68... i just finished cleaning the tank with 25 % water change when I did my first reading... this morning the pH was 7.8 and the tds was 128... the rest of the parameters have stayed the same... my concern is I want to add some german blue rams and was told that my pH was too high.. not really interested if they mate or not.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

the tds was 128... ... .

OK, that is quite informative. What it means is that you don't have a huge amount of electrolytes in your water, which is quite promising for keeping soft water fish. I don't tend to worry too much about pH (I don't keep any real black-water fish), but look more at TDS.

my concern is I want to add some german blue rams and was told that my pH was too high.. not really interested if they mate or not.

I think they will be OK. Because you don't have a lot of bases, you could lower the pH with a weak acid, like <"citric acid"> (C6H8O7), and a source of tannins like sphagnum peat or Oak (Quercus) leaves.

cheers Darrel

 

[mgfiest]

Thanks for the info I get them tonight

 

[mgfiest]

well i tested the water from the lfs and it had a pH 7.5 and tds 475 and i am putting them in my tank which is 7.8 and tds of 128... i acclimatize the 2 gbr before putting them into the tank... i am still concern they are not gonna survive.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

well i tested the water from the lfs and it had a pH 7.5 and tds 475 and i am putting them in my tank which is 7.8 and tds of 128...

The LFS water parameters don't surprise me, you may have seen Joe Gargas's articles on conductivity and fish shops <"http://www.tbas1.com/TBASpdf/May2009.pdf"> (from page 4.), it is well worth a read.

i acclimatize the 2 gbr before putting them into the tank... i am still concern they are not gonna survive.

I must admit I like to get the fish into my tank pretty quickly, even if there is a difference in water parameters.

No fish are "difficult" if you give them the right parameters, but all fish have specific tolerances. If you like there is a "sweet spot" where long term survival is possible, difficult fish have a small "sweet spot". Some fish need extreme water conditions (Lake Tanganyikan fish, "black-water fish"), some have a very specialized diet and some have a single critical parameter (high levels of dissolved oxygen for large rheophilic loricariids) that must be maintained. Often one parameter can be sub-optimal if the other parameters are well within the species tolerances.

Because of this I wouldn't worry about the pH if you can match the requirements for food, habitat etc. I think Bob Wiltshire's site gives a pretty good break-down of what you need <"Aquarium Care"> & <"Mikrogeophagus ramirezi">.

Having said that I think there are specific problems with commercially bred Rams, and that is a lot of the stock is very poor quality and disease prone. Personally I would only buy Rams from a local breeder, I wouldn't get them from a shop.

cheers Darrel

 

[mgfiest]

my lfs buys from a "local" if you call 300km away local... and has been successful with staying alive in his tanks. my setup with the tank and cleaning practices as per bob wiltshire's site is pretty much the same.

 

[gerald]

The key with ramirezi is to get fish that aren't already weakened and infected with bacteria and parasites, as many of the commercially farmed ones seem to be. Rams can survive long-term and breed with pH 7.5 to 8.0 and moderate GH hardness, even though wild rams occur is softer, lower pH conditions.

 

[Mike Wise]

I tend to agree with Darrel and Gerald. Orinoco Rams come from the Llanos of northern South America where pH and hardness values fluctuate considerably, depending on the season. Florida fish farms were breeding tons of healthy Rams in the 50s & 60s in water we would consider 'liquid cement'. It seems that consistent health problems only appeared after the Asian farms out-competed the Florida farms in the 70s.

 

[mgfiest]

thanks for the info