Pelvicachromis taeniatus ‘Moliwe’

[Ryze_Gr]

Hi.
I will have a pair of Pelvicachromis taeniatus ‘Moliwe’ in a few days and I would like to make a perfect aquarium for them,just as their biotope.
I know that they are being collected in west Cameroon,near Moliwe's village and I have some questions about that.What is the name of the river that they are being collected?
Is the water clean or full of tannins like Amazon?
tjudy told me some information about their biotope.If I can find more that would make my try easier and my fish happier.:biggrin:
In which other places in West Africa we can found this form and how is this biotope?
Sorry for too many questions but these fishes are adorable and I want to provide them the best conditions.
Thank you.

 

[Ryze_Gr]

I just bought a pair of taeniatus moliwe but I am not sure that are really moliwe.:frown:
The male is red under his eyes as nigerian red form is.
Can you please tell me the differences that have moliwe and negerian red between them,especially the females?
Please help.
Thanks.

 

[Joe Gatchell]

I just bought a pair of taeniatus moliwe but I am not sure that are really moliwe.:frown:
The male is red under his eyes as nigerian red form is.
Can you please tell me the differences that have moliwe and negerian red between them,especially the females?
Please help.
Thanks.

Can you post a photograph? That will help with ID.

 

[Ryze_Gr]

I 'll post tomorrow.Thanks.

 

[Ryze_Gr]

Here are some photos of my pair.Can you recognise them?Male is red under his eyes (male1) but not always(male2).Also,it has a bit of red in his dorsal fin as you can see in photos(male3).These are some things that make me believe,it is not moliwe but nigerian red.What about female?What form is it?
http://s881.photobucket.com/albums/ac14/tsoulojim/taeniatus/

 

[Shernutz]

Irisdescence around spots

I distinctly remember reading somewhere that Ted stated that the Moliwe type would not have irisdescence around its ocelli spots. Moliwe is unique that the black spots are small and cleanly on yellow.

The female photo 4 and 5 clearly have "irisdescence" i.e. that blue hue around the black spots. The male photo 3 suggest that as well.

In addition, the spots are big.

I am no expert but they probably are not Moliwe; BUT they are still very BEAUTIFUL.

Other than that, I have no clue. ? Dehane

Best wait for Ted to come back from Gabon and review the photos for you.

 

[Joe Gatchell]

Doesn't look like any Moliwe I've seen either. Not sure what region though.

 

[aquaticclarity]

Agreed that the fish isn't P. t. Moliwe. Wrong tail pattern.

They do look more like the Nigerian taeniatus types. (But not perfectly) Only the green and yellow morphs are collected from Nigeria in the wild. The red form is either GREATLY restricted to a very small location in the wild or much more likley is a selectively bred form out of the yellow and/or green form. No one knows were the red form is found in the wild and any Nigerian Red taeniatus in the hobby come from established line bred stock.

Do you know if the fish in question are wild or tank raised fish?

Jeff

 

[Ryze_Gr]

According to the Lfs the pair is tank raised.
Do you think they are hybrids?

 

[gerald]

Looking at your female, I almost wonder if there's a kribensis among their ancestors.

According to the Lfs the pair is tank raised.
Do you think they are hybrids?

 

[Joe Gatchell]

Looking at your female, I almost wonder if there's a kribensis among their ancestors.

I don't see p. pulcher in that female personally.

 

[Ryze_Gr]

It's sure that they are not moliwe.
Also,they are not any of Nigerian type,perfectly.
So,what are they?
I'm confused and I am afraid to let them together in case of reproduction.

 

[Rod]

I would say they are the yellow form of Nigerian taeniatus

 

[Ryze_Gr]

Is that possible?
The Nigerian yellow form has no red under his eyes.Right?
Also,I would like to ask you what does "tank strains" mean?

 

[gerald]

A "pure" strain in captivity may become different from its wild ancestors simply because a breeder selects for desireable traits that are not the ones that nature would select for. Suppose one in a thousand wild Nigerian yellow taeniatus are born with genes that produce red cheek pigment, but rarely if ever survive. But we like them because they're pretty, so in captivity the red-cheek fish survive and breed. Thus we get "tank strains" even when we're careful not to mix different regional populations.

Is that possible?
The Nigerian yellow form has no red under his eyes.Right?
Also,I would like to ask you what does "tank strains" mean?

 

[Ryze_Gr]

Thank you.
So,the only "problem" with tank strains fishes is that we cannot find them in nature?

A "pure" strain in captivity may become different from its wild ancestors simply because a breeder selects for desireable traits that are not the ones that nature would select for. Suppose one in a thousand wild Nigerian yellow taeniatus are born with genes that produce red cheek pigment, but rarely if ever survive. But we like them because they're pretty, so in captivity the red-cheek fish survive and breed. Thus we get "tank strains" even when we're careful not to mix different regional populations.

 

[aquaticclarity]

Thank you.
So,the only "problem" with tank strains fishes is that we cannot find them in nature?

More or less. It's not really a problem. It's more a matter of knowing what you have in your tanks. Pretty fish are just that, pretty fish. Getting bogged down in the name game (or generations removed from the wild (F1,F2, etc.) isn't always worth the time. Especially when it comes to seldom collected or fish with limited wild popultaions. Some captive breed fish are spitting images of the same fish in the wild and others aren't. Pelvicachromis taeniatus (and many Apistosgramma spp.) have a lot of natural varition in their colors and patterns just with in a given population of fish. This lends itself well to selective breeding for specific traits as well as HUGE variation among sibling fish even when traits aren't being singled out for breeding.

As Gerarld said, captive breed fish (tank strain) can look like their wild ancesters or they can look very different. Either thing is bad, just natural. Taking any fish out of the wild and breeding it is selectively breeding a fish in the sense that natural selection of mates is gone or greatly reduced. Moving on to generations beyond the wild collected fish creates even more of a genetic bottle neck. Some stunning fish can come from the careful selective breeding of fish but the fish may no longer look like it's related wild population. The same thing happens in the wild though. Fish select mates based on certain traits-could be color, size, finage, aggression, etc. It doesn't matter what the reason, it's still natural selection of a mate which means the natural excluision of some traits over others.

 

[Ryze_Gr]

I think that my pair is similar to dehane form or even nigerian green type but without the red under male's eyes.

 

[Rod]

the tail is typical nigerian type
Spots on top of tail break edge of tail
and a line at edge of tail to bottom half

Given yellow in the body...and the tail pattern....Nigerian yellow seems logical to me???

dehane ....the tail spots are within the tail and don't cross the edge of the fin
the only thing similar to dehane is the red line under the eye!

 

[Ryze_Gr]

So,can they be cross between Nigerian and Cameroon forms?