Have Mercy On Me

[Crazygar]

I recently came received an Eclipse 6 system from a Photo Contest. I happened to win the thing without any consideration what the prize was! Now that I have this tank, I was wondering (please, do not hit me hard) if there is any Dwarf Cichlid that would enjoy such small space.

I have my heart set on Dicrossus filamentosa but I know that a 6GAL (16" LONG X 8" WIDE X 10" TALL) might be on the little side. Is it possible or is it a death sentence committed to solitary confinment.

Gary

 

[Apistt_ed]

I would say that in the eclipse tank such as yours you've won, congrats on that, may be able to handle Dicrossus depending on the actual fishes. I have found them to be fish that need a larger tank than most other dwarfs because of their aggression issues that I have observed. I would suggest A. borellii as a better alternative to you because they have been kept tanks smaller than yours and successfully spawned also. Their temper is fairly timid, if you can say that about any cichlid, and would look great in an eclipse tank! Make sure to plant the tank accordingly and take pictures!! I love the way eclipse tanks look! best of luck and keep us posted! cheers john

 

[Crazygar]

I finally settled on a pair of A.nijsseni. As long as I keep up with the water changes, (biweekly if I have to) then I think these will be fine. Folks (extremely seasoned) state that A.nijsseni would be a good choice.

Yes, all my tanks are PLANTED to the max! My 55GAL looks like a giant Aquatic Salad (gotta work on that one this weekend) and my other tanks have ample plants and cover.

Gary

 

[Mike Wise]

If your A. nijsseni aren't a bonded pair, more likely than not you will end up with only one fish. A. borellii would be a much better option.

 

[tjnelson44]

I have a pair of A. nijsseni that can't even get along in a 20 long. It was just to small. They got along pretty good after I moved them to a 40 breeder. Another pair I had lived and spawned in a 20 long but there was always a lot of friction between the pair. More than one A. nijsseni in a six gallon would probaly not turn out well.
Trevor

 

[Crazygar]

I am begining to feel the hot tar.

I understand the compatibility issue is the most important one for Aquaria of a small size. I have been in contact with someone whom has kept a pair of A.nijsseni in a 5GAL for 4yrs now with no conflicts and many batches of fry. Bearing that each situation is different, a "larger" tank will be made available if conflicts and issues due rise.

I understand the importance of larger tanks for our Apistos, but I am in the middle of tearing down my fish room (this means 1 35GAL and 1 55GAL tanks need to be torn down) for upgrades to the electricity and plumbing and new flooring (I hate carpet) put down. I am working on a Colombian Biotope tank in my living room (need some research on A.nijsseni) which I can easily replace A.cacutoides with A.nijsseni if they fit the biotope (Colombia) parameters.

The Eclipse6 was (and is the first) something I won! I have such an urge to have Apistogramma, that it will eventually drive me insane. The consideration of placing a pair of A.nijsseni into a 6gal tank comes from measurements, tank conditions and information based on the myth of "Desktop Cichlids".

But as I stated I am ready to move (if necessary) if problems do arise. As usual, I will keep a journal of my progress. Starting from Tank Creation to moving in its citizens.

Gary (just plain stubborn)

 

[tjnelson44]

I was just sharing my personal experiences with nijsseni. Some fish have unique personalities. Mine are exceptionaly nasty. It is not impossible to do what you want to do, it just can be very difficult depending on your fish. I have also heard of people having success with nijsseni in small tanks but this is not the norm. As long as you are ready to move them to another tank if things turn nasty, go for it. There are things that can increase your chances for success like really heavy planting, lots of structure, and target/dither fish. Something that has worked for me to protect the female from the male was to add lots african drift wood over a sandy substrate. I introduced the female two weeks before the male. By the time the male was placed in the tank, the female had excavated a series of tunnels under the wood. When the male got nasty, she had numerous escape routes and hiding places were he could not follow. I hope your project goes well, good luck.
Trevor

 

[Crazygar]

Some fish have unique personalities. Mine are exceptionaly nasty.

Joy. Yeah, my American Flag Fish are "supposed" to have horrible tank manners, yet they are the most docile fish I have ever owned!

Yes, each fish has its own unique personality. I am hoping that my Female/Male are docile!

It is not impossible to do what you want to do, it just can be very difficult depending on your fish. I have also heard of people having success with nijsseni in small tanks but this is not the norm. As long as you are ready to move them to another tank if things turn nasty, go for it.

I'm always up to the challenge, and yes, if things turn out for the worse, I have a backup tank in which they will be placed to possibly satisfy the "cramped" quarters behaviour. I am sure that most "unwanted" behaviour come from closed quarters, but I am willing to give it a shot. I hear conflicting reports from different people.

My information and research states the A.nijsseni comes from Southeastern Colombia so that will satisfy the "Colombian" connection. If all is worse, then its time to move into the BIOTOPE tank (might be a better idea down the road anyways) where they will have 53GAL of play room.

There are things that can increase your chances for success like really heavy planting, lots of structure, and target/dither fish.

I am all ABOUT planted tanks. The denser the better. Mainly Anubias barteri var.nana, Stargrass, a few Crypts tossed in for leaf shape and L.aromatica. As for structure, rocks and wood placement is a definate must. Looks like I will be going with Onyx sand as opposed to Flourite.

For TARGET/DITHER, what you suggest? 3 male guppies? Or 3 female guppies? I do not wish to sacrifice my Otocinclus (cleanup) for targets. I will be supplying some Ghost Shrimp for live food on occassion to keep them happy.

Something that has worked for me to protect the female from the male was to add lots african drift wood over a sandy substrate. I introduced the female two weeks before the male. By the time the male was placed in the tank, the female had excavated a series of tunnels under the wood

Sounds like a great piece of advice, thanks Trevor. I will definately go this route when adding the Apistos to the tank. Female first and then 2 weeks later the male. I'll chat with my dealer about keeping the Male (will pay for him though) another 2 weeks while I acclimatize the female. I should have no problem with this.

Actually, you have some great pointers and ideas. Thanks again!
Gary

 

[tjnelson44]

I have heard the same thing about flag fish. The only problem I have had with them is that they seem to really like the taste of my wisteria. I have never used the onyx sand but I have heard that it will buffer your water so you might want to look into that. I don't have a specific species of fish that I use for targets. I just throw in what ever I happen to have at the moment that fits the bill. I have never used guppies so I have no personal experience with them, but as I am writing this, I am staring at my girlfriend's planted five gallon guppy cube. The males are not as fast as the females due to the huge tail. I would probaly use females if I were to use guppies since the males might not be quick enough to get away if they are of one of the varieties with really large tails. If you didn't want to leave the male at the store, you could pick up a guppy breader or a breeding net and place him in it. It can also be used to seperate the fish if things get nasty. You could put the aggressive one in the breeder for a week or so to give the other one a break. When they are back together, the other fish may hold its ground better. Keep us posted on the progress. I am curious to see how it turns out.
Trevor

 

[tjnelson44]

I forgot to mention something. The reason I took the 2 week delay in adding the male to the tank was because he is big and mean. If the fish were of comparable size and the female had the tank to her self for a while then she might give the male a butt kicking when he is added. I guess you could just decide once you get your fish. Best of luck to you.
Trevor

 

[Mike Wise]

My information and research states the A.nijsseni comes from Southeastern Colombia so that will satisfy the "Colombian" connection.

Wherever you got you information, it should be ignored. A. nijsseni comes from the Rio Copal & Rio Carahuayte, right bank (eastern) tributaries of the lower Rio Ucayali, south of Iquitos, Peru. If you want Colombian species, consider using one of the following: A. macmaser-group species, A. iniridae, or A. sp. Breitbinden. There are others, too, but they aren't common in the hobby.

 

[Crazygar]

Firstly Trevor;

I have heard the same thing about flag fish. The only problem I have had with them is that they seem to really like the taste of my wisteria

Watching their antics (Male/Female) is the closest so far to something similiar to Apistogramma. They are beyond the best little algae eaters I have next to my thriving Otocinclus colony.

I have never used the onyx sand but I have heard that it will buffer your water so you might want to look into that

I use Onyx Sand in my daughters 19GAL planted paradise and I have a pH reading of 6.4 in there. Of course, I put peat in media bags in the filter and inject Co2 in there. But I find the Onyx sand more "pleasing" than Flourite. I might just go with the Flourite (I have 1/2 a bag left) and mix it in with some regular old sand. I wish a nice "sandy" substrate (looks more natural).

but as I am writing this, I am staring at my girlfriend's planted five gallon guppy cube.

I smell trouble brewing. Fight the tempatation! Yeah, I planned to use a couple of Female Guppies as dithers. Maybe even some White Clouds would fit the bill.

you could pick up a guppy breader or a breeding net and place him in it. It can also be used to seperate the fish if things get nasty.

Hmph, another good idea. Kinda use it as a "Penalty Box" (gawd, I miss the Hockey season) for bad behaviour in the tank. I like it.

I forgot to mention something. The reason I took the 2 week delay in adding the male to the tank was because he is big and mean. If the fish were of comparable size and the female had the tank to her self for a while then she might give the male a butt kicking when he is added. I guess you could just decide once you get your fish. Best of luck to you.

My dealer always pulls through for me. I will give him some specific instructions on a pair of Apistogramma nijsseni, Male/Female of comparable size and "compatibility", this almost sounds like a dating service for fish "I like water, plants and other fish... dislikes... predators..."

Mike Wise;

Wherever you got you information, it should be ignored. A. nijsseni comes from the Rio Copal & Rio Carahuayte, right bank (eastern) tributaries of the lower Rio Ucayali, south of Iquitos, Peru

Hmph, I figured it would be to good to be true. Thanks for the information. Its always nice to know where an animal comes from.

If you want Colombian species, consider using one of the following: A. macmaser-group species, A. iniridae, or A. sp. Breitbinden. There are others, too, but they aren't common in the hobby.

A.iniridae are nice. I actually seen these guys at an LFS in Detroit awhile back and I was impressed with the colouration. Thanks again!

Gary

 

[Crazygar]

After doing MORE research (wow, at least 4-6 hours worth of reading) I have decided, that yes, A.nijsseni would not be suited for such close quarters. Generally, I think my Amano shrimp would be the first to perish under the wrath of the A.nijsseni in the tank.

I have decided on wild A.borelli pair as my Apisto choice for the tank. They are more hardy and will acclimatize better to the tank. From all of the reading and responses here (and on another forum), A.nijsseni are not exactly the beginners Apisto. My stubborness was driving me mostly to this decision. After some rational thought (and research), A.borelli is more suited to the parameters.

I will keep everyone posted on the progress of the tank and fish when they arrive.

Gary

 

[Crazygar]

Ok, the tank has arrived and already been modified. Yeah, the 6GAL Eclipse is quite an impressive little tank. I think a pair of A.borelli will do fine in here.

Since folks in eariler responses wish to be "kept up to date" this following thread consists of lots of reading and finally pictures at the end. Here goes..

- The Tank -
The tank, measures roughly, 16" long, 8" wide and 12" tall. My previous idea of Aquascaping will actually fit in this tank. It comes standard with an 8W 12" NO (Normal Output) Fluorescent light and Mini-BioWheel filtration system. Acrylic and lightweight, the entire tank weighs about 3lbs!

- Lighting -
My original idea consisted of serious high light plants such as Limnophllia aromatica (which I keep in my 19GAL and are truly beautiful plants) and Lobelia cardinalis (Cardinal Flower which I grow from seed). Both these plants need at least 2.5WPG to prosper. STOCK lighting for an Eclipse6 is 1.1WPG and judging from the depth, would not be enough for even some of the low light plants.

I purchased a JBJ Clamp Light (PL-CL1-19) from a store in Roseville MI (Oceans and Seas) which gave me an 18W Power Compact Bulb to place over the tank.

Problem #1: The JBJ Clamp Light, even with the "telescopic arms" down at their lowest level is still a good 5" away from the tank
Resolution : I "removed" the "arms" and hooked the light DIRECTLY to the clamp, giving me light RIGHT OVER the tank

Problem #2: The Mini-BioWheel filtration system blocks 90% of light as much as the filter access canopy on the top of the Eclipse6
Resolution : I removed the canopy entirely (right easy) and removed the Mini-Biowheel and replaced it with a Fluval 1+ Internal Filter (mounted horizontal).

Problem #3: The light that comes "standard" with the JBJ Clamp Light is a Dual 10,000K/420nm bulb. Useless for planted tank purposes.
Resolution : I have placed an order for Dual Daylight (6,700K/10,000K) 18W Straight Pin Power Compact

Now, I kept the orignal 8W NO light (only the filter access canopy was removed, which makes the tank 90% covered) to give me an additional 8W of light giving me a total of 26W of light. Doing your math, this gives me 4.33WPG! Definately enough for a NanoPlanted Tank.

- Filtration -
Now that I removed the Mini-Biowheel, I had to replace it with some that will be reliable and make "less" surface agitation! The Fluval 1+ Internal Filter was the perfect answer and size. Placement will be horizontal against the backwall as no to interfere with the Aquascape. I hear grumbling that a "SPRAYBAR" kit exists, I might look into that. At the current moment, the Fluval 1+ is "seeding" in my 55GAL Community Tank.

- Heating -
I plan to purchase a 50W 8" heater for the tank. I am going to set the thermostat at 75F and more or less rely on the lights to warm the tank mostly, with the heater working during only in the night hours. I realize that Apistos like a temp around 68-78, so I am going to find a nice happy inbetween.

- Substrate -
Since it is going to be planted, I had to find something that was suitable (and dark) for the tank. Onyx Sand comes in 20lb bags and so does EcoComplete. Flourite as well comes in the larger bag. Having taking the measurements, I would barely use a 1/3 of a bag of the aforementioned substrates.

Until I remembered -- Laterite! Comes in "Milk Carton" containers! Perfect! Full of the good stuff and nice red colour (oh well, can't win them all!). So, I have purchased one "Carton" for now. This should be fine.

- Decor -
Picked up a cool piece of Driftwood at a LFS in Livonia MI (Pet Connection) in which makes thing look really unique! The wood, with a few rocks will make for some visual barriers and terrority (in 6GAL tank, room is a commodity). Background will obviously be black.

- Flora -
This is the list of plants that will I be planted (have these all in my other 4 tanks) in ApistoTank;

Limnophlla aromatica, Lobelia cardinalis (Cardinal Flower), Heterantha zosterfolia (Star Grass), Cryptocoryne willisi x.lucens, Anubias barteri var.nana (Dwarf Anubias)

- Fauna -
Apistogramma borelli (Male and Female), 3 X Caridina japonica (Amano Shrimp, 2" a piece!), 2 X Otocinclus vittatus

The tank (due to space restrictions and home improvement projects planned for spring) will be on my Kitchen countertop to serve as something relaxing in a room we spend a lot time in. This is just a "temporary" setup until I redo my "Office/Fish Room" into something more suiting (carpeting -- AUGH!).

Here are 2 small pictures of the tank which will eventually house the A.borelli;

Gary

And from a distance to give you an idea on the "JBJ Clamp Light"

 

[Joelio]

I'm quite the fan of planted tanks, since i keep one myself. I must say your tank is going to look awesome. I like your lighting alternative you provided. What are you doing for CO2, and ferts??? I can't wait to see the apistos in there :biggrin:

-Joel

 

[Crazygar]

Still considering the Hagen PlantGRO system, but I am going for "looks" in this tank, so I might have to figure out a Co2 retrofit for the tank. If anyone has a great idea I am all ears.

If not, I plan to dose with Flourish Excel w/Potassium every 2 days. This is the critical part of the tank that I have not quite figured out yet. If Co2 is to work, my internal filter will need that SPRAYBAR kit with the Co2 being injected directly into the "SPRAYBAR". Not sure how to overcome this one.

Gary
BTW:Extremely anxious myself, as this tank will be up and running well before my 53GAL Colombiatope project.

 

[depthc]

Sounds good but one, wait two thing signal a red flag for me.

For your substrate are you going to be using laterite exclusively? I sure hope not, its great stuff but you will never see the tank clear since its pretty much clay. It will cloud up the tank any time its disturbed. Laterite is perfect but you will need to cover it in some thing such as play sand or gravel whatever you pick.

And you say your going to add shrimp to the tank. The borelli will tear them up and make a great meal out of them so shrimp may be out of the question.

Otherwise everything sounds great. Youve got a good start and you've got a plan so your set. Keep us updated :wink: .

Andrew

 

[Crazygar]

Ok, what I have done is the following;

Placed a "laterite" layer at the bottom. Then, on top, a gravel/laterite mixture. With a "U" Sand shaped area. The driftwood I just picked up and I am hunting down a good 50W (This weekend) Heater.

The hardscaping is almost complete, getting anxious to "toss in" the plants and get'er rocking for now. Meijer has Hydor 50W submersable heaters for $9.99US so on my way to Sarnia on Mar.26, I plan to pick up a heater!

I still am planning to add a "ROCK" to the hardscape and then start my planting.

The "U" shaped area of sand will settle into the gravel (on the outskirts) while the stuff just "naked" will remain in its current location. Planning to use some "Malaysian Trumpet Snails" for substrate burrowers.

Here is the latest pic of Apistotank with just the 8W "Natural Daylight" bulb on. I plan to follow the current sequence for my photoperiod;

(1) 12hrs 8W "Natural Daylight". 10am in the morning to 10pm at night
(2) 10hrs 18W "10,000K", 12pm to 8pm to simulate MID DAY

The sand at the corners kinda overlapped the "GRAVEL/LATERITE" mix. This should settle in leaving on the sand layer visible in the end.

Gary

 

[Joelio]

For CO2 I recommend the Hagen system. IMO it is the best. Their diffuser is what takes the cake. I think those little tanks are great little things, and make perfect nanos.

 

[Crazygar]

Yeah, the diffuser, especially in smaller tanks, really stands out. I wonder if I could "retrofit" that Fluval 1+ to help with Co2 injection. Another websearch and quest has started.

Gary