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What type of apistogramma is this?

Discussion in 'Apistogramma' started by mantisfan101, Jun 27, 2019.

  1. mantisfan101

    mantisfan101 New Member

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    View attachment 8568 View attachment 8569 View attachment 8570 I initially thought cacatuoides since thatw as what they were labelled as at the pet store and the male looked like a wild male cacatuoides but after seeing him flare something’s not right. His fins completely darken and now Im stumped. I don’t even know if the females are cacatuoides anymore.
  2. Ekona

    Ekona Active Member 5 Year Member

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    What fish store did you purchase it from?
  3. mantisfan101

    mantisfan101 New Member

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    EFB03A3B-D1F5-43FD-8BC3-EBD12D492983.png A2B07CEC-9480-49CA-A2C1-364FD8901F7F.png Seems like pics didn’t show up; here they are and I got them from petco.
  4. Ekona

    Ekona Active Member 5 Year Member

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    Well you lucked out. Can you get photos of the female and maybe a better photo of the male with fins
    more open?
  5. mantisfan101

    mantisfan101 New Member

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    823C7794-DB0C-429C-A8F8-07E8E7B4F01B.jpeg Tried my best, these guys won’t stay still for anything, even if they’re flaring at their own reflection.
    Here’s a video of the females eating and the male doing his thing-
  6. mantisfan101

    mantisfan101 New Member

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    Also if it helps the females seem to have long ventrals just like a male but also have the regular yellow coloration of the body.
  7. Ekona

    Ekona Active Member 5 Year Member

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    It looks like wild form A. cacatuoides based on dorsal fins extensions, abdominal stripes, caudal fin shape and pattern and lateral line/caudal spot pattern. The black coloration in the fins in the first photos you posted is somewhat unique (in my experience) and thus it could be an A. cf. cacatuoides form. In the video the fish appear to be a more standard wild A. cacatuoides form, say from peru. I'm also of the opinion that the fishes shown in the video are all males, (with the possible exception of the third fish in the series) perhaps younger and smaller than the final larger one, but still showing male traits.

    Did you purchase all of the ones the Petco had? If not you might want to get them all in hopes of getting (more) females?
  8. mantisfan101

    mantisfan101 New Member

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    They only had 4 and the last one was getting picked on by the ithers; plus, he was missing his caudal tail which I assumes the others ripped off. Here’s a video of one of my suspect females-
  9. mantisfan101

    mantisfan101 New Member

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    06E7847B-85ED-4133-A367-9D2C366BDA04.jpeg CC14178E-0DF1-45AE-92F7-A094B7E256C2.jpeg A46BD773-815E-41ED-91CA-6BA5692EFD3A.jpeg 210B6469-9231-4846-8C22-40FB901E0875.jpeg 2D1A5F24-A6E5-442D-80C6-2F564251D78E.jpeg 52CB6982-8D54-4334-98F2-E8BA704A4B64.jpeg Here’s pics of the probable female and the male flaring-
  10. Ekona

    Ekona Active Member 5 Year Member

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    Video shows female, and photos show both male and female, so you should be good to go with breeding them if you choose to. Looks like a good setup with plenty of leaf litter. Keep us posted!
    mantisfan101 likes this.
  11. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    Fish look like A. alpahuayo, not A. cacatuoides, to me.
  12. Ekona

    Ekona Active Member 5 Year Member

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    It sure could be A.allpahuayo, but I'm not seeing a clear separation between the lateral band and the caudal peduncle spot, as it diagnostic of A. allpahuayo.
  13. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    More separation than on most cacatuoides, plus the female shows the black chin of alpahuayo.
  14. Ekona

    Ekona Active Member 5 Year Member

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    But more connection than most A. allpahuayo? And do not female A. cacatuoides females have the same black on their chins as the female pictured here?
  15. Frank_H

    Frank_H Active Member

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    Regarding the caudal spot it could be an exceptional specimen of both species in question. But imo the shape and size of the female's chin marking and the bluish/greyish lips of the male in the first photos point towards A. cacatuoides.
  16. mantisfan101

    mantisfan101 New Member

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    Now that I look at it could it be rocafuerte?
  17. Frank_H

    Frank_H Active Member

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    That's not impossible either.
  18. Ekona

    Ekona Active Member 5 Year Member

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    The caudal spot in A. sp. 'Rocafuerte', from my experience, tends to be more of a square and extend somewhat into the caudal fin. And, as Mike W. has pointed out in a previous post, A. sp. 'Rocafuerte' tends to have diagonal rows of dark streaks. You can see both characteristics in photos below of fish I had some time ago labeled as A. sp. 'Rocafuerte'.
    Also see Tom C.'s site for photos of A. sp. 'Rocafuerte/Shaly'.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Your fish shows what appear to be more clearly defined rows of abdominal stripes, and the caudal spot appears to more closely resemble that of A. cacatuoides.

    Also, there have been recent imports to LFS of wild A. cacutuoides in the US, which would suggest that finding such a Petco is not out of the question. However, I have to wonder what the chances are of Petco receiving a shipment of A. sp. 'Rocafuerte'. Possible as a by-catch of some other more common S.A. fish, but still far less likely than A. cacatuoides. Put it this way, if the fish you purchased at your local Petco turn out to A. sp. 'Rocafuerte', then you have scored big time! But if they are wild A. cacatudoides or A. allpahuayo, you have still scored are very nice find. Let them grow out and continue to take photos, possibly with some side lighting or better overhead lighting to bring out some of the features in your photos. It will be very interesting to see how they develop.
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2019
    dw1305 and MickeM like this.