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Apistogramma Papagei/Pebas?

Yo-han

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5 Year Member
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74
Location
The Netherlands
Bought a couple wild caught Apistogramma, labelled as Papagei. Looking online I'm leaning towards Pebas. Anyone any thought looking at these phone pics (still very shy in my heavily planted tank so the best pictures I could make)

uploadfromtaptalk1410083217869.jpg
uploadfromtaptalk1410083235904.jpg
 

Mike Wise

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It's either rather uncolorful/unhappy A. sp. Papagei or A. sp. Roca Eterna. I'll know for sure when I see the female in brood dress. Papagei - 2, rarely 3 lateral spots; Roca Eterna - 4+ lateral spots.
 

Yo-han

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5 Year Member
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74
Location
The Netherlands
Never heard of that species, but one of the other females in the sales tank turned yellow last week and had 6-7 spots. So Roca Eterna sound plausible.

The fish were only in the tank 3 days when I took the pictures so I hope they colour up a little. Very shy, but are becoming more bold now. Thanks Mike!
 

Yo-han

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5 Year Member
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74
Location
The Netherlands
Hi Darrel, it's a Caridina pareparensis parvidentata (MalaWa shrimp). They can eat all they want, in fact I hope they do (good protein), I got hundreds of them in a very heavily planted tank, so I don't think they will ever get them all:) With 4 Dicrossus in there and 2 ramirezis the number of shrimps still increased. As long as they stay away from my Amano shrimp (my Nannacara didn't) I'm fine with it!
 

dw1305

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Wiltshire UK
Hi Darrel, it's a Caridina pareparensis parvidentata (MalaWa shrimp). They can eat all they want, in fact I hope they do (good protein), I got hundreds of them in a very heavily planted tank, so I don't think they will ever get them all
Excellent, send them over to the UK. Are they all right at lower pH values?

cheers Darrel
 

Yo-han

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5 Year Member
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74
Location
The Netherlands
They're all right in anything! I kept them in a Wabi-Kusa bowl with only a few centiliter water, temperature is between 20 celcius at night and over 40 when the sun hits the bowl. The water in their was very soft and acidic at the end of the week and I changed it with cold hard tap water, they didn't mind. Only time I killed a few was when the bowl ran dry, so they do need water:p
 

Mike Wise

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Hmm. The female definitely looks like A. sp. Pebas, based on the shape of the caudal patch. Male A. sp. Pebas almost always show some rows of spots somewhere on the caudal fin, which neither A. sp. Papagei nor A. sp. Roca Eterna show. Does your male ever show spots on the tail?
 

Yo-han

Member
5 Year Member
Messages
74
Location
The Netherlands
Ok, but this female was way larger than the other females and even bigger than most males so I 'm not sure they are all from the same shipment. Here a better picture of my male and female:
uploadfromtaptalk1410687776777.jpg

uploadfromtaptalk1410687785506.jpg

uploadfromtaptalk1410687806169.jpg

uploadfromtaptalk1410687822903.jpg


Are these more clear?
 

Yo-han

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5 Year Member
Messages
74
Location
The Netherlands
More pictures from the male and female:
uploadfromtaptalk1411307226125.jpg

uploadfromtaptalk1411307251278.jpg

uploadfromtaptalk1411307322075.jpg

uploadfromtaptalk1411307352392.jpg


If these are still not helpful, please do tell what is important to show in the photo besides black markings...
 

Mike Wise

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Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
The female looks like A. sp. Pebas; the male like A. sp. Putumayo. Am I absolutely positive? No. If you want a better ID from me I'd need to see these fish with all of their dark markings showing at one time. Unfortunately, the best way to see this is preserve in ethanol.
 

ADC Nederland

Member
Messages
86
Location
Purmerend, The Netherlands
They look like Sp. Papagei to me but Mike is way more experiences at ID-ing then me... But from what I can tell from the photos and the comparisons that I can make to the Papagei I had, it looks to be Papagei.
 

Yo-han

Member
5 Year Member
Messages
74
Location
The Netherlands
Or like in the other thread, it is an Apistogramma ortegai (Papagei form). Both male and female seem to match with C and D.
 

ADC Nederland

Member
Messages
86
Location
Purmerend, The Netherlands
Yeah, to me it's still Papagei since non of my suppliers have updated the names yet, but the new name is indeed Apistogramma ortegai, or so the powers that be say...

I have some Videos of my Papagei, maybe that will help you.

Part 1:
Part 2:
 

Yo-han

Member
5 Year Member
Messages
74
Location
The Netherlands
The female is starting to show breeding colors. The beautiful thing about this female is that she shows red and blue in her anal and dorsal fin as well. Barely visible at the photo.

Tried to capture the male black markings as well. Did this by making him flare with a mirror:
(Note the long fins!)
 

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Mike Wise

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Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
Although ADC Nederland's videos aren't ideal for identification, from what I see, I would say that Yo-han's specimens are from the same mix or location. Neither look like the 'real' A. ortegai (Papagei form). Females of A. ortegai, in brood dress, will show only 2 flank spots, while females of A. cf. ortegai (Pebas) and A. cf. ortegai (Roca Eterna) show 4 (or more) flank spots. This is the easiest way to separate A. ortegai from the other forms/species.
 

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